Land swapping between Toledo and TPS, beyond Longfellow and Bowman…
While some of the parents and the residents of the area surrounding Longfellow School differ on what they think is best for the children versus the neighborhood surrounding the present location of Longfellow School, there’s a bit more involved to what is taking place. I think it would be helpful to look at the land that the City would be gaining, especially one piece in particular, 3117 Nebraska Avenue, the site of the former Ryder School and I’m also providing a short summary of what took place at yesterday’s Youth, Parks & Recreation Committee meeting.
The area in red is 3117 Nebraska, the area in yellow is where Xunlight is currently located, 3145 Nebraska Avenue, they are considering expanding and it could involve that space if the City were to own it. Google maps has a better image than Areis for those you interested in googling either address. A public school system has more procedures as to how they can trade or sell property, hence swapping it with a governmental entity, like a city, gives the city more options as to what can be done with a building/property, especially when it comes to “giving” property.
This was a confusing issue for some on council, it involves two previous pieces of legislation, one passed in 1995 and one passed in 2004 concerning Start High School, parts of Bowman Park and the new YMCA located there. Where questions were duplicated, I’ve tried to shorten this by stating that and not repeating them.
For those of you interested in the short version who don’t want to continue to read the notes from the Committee meeting, TPS would be able to amend the 1995 agreement and not have to donate land back to the City as the original land swap deal for the Bowman Park area and Start High School called for if Ordinance 643 is approved, that land would be used to build a new Longfellow Elementary School next to Start High School and the new YMCA. The current Longfellow building would be demolished and it’s been suggested it would be a park, or zoned park land. Ordinance 642 involves swapping other property, the Ryder School location, a piece of land on Glendale to the City of Toledo and a small triangle of land by Devilbiss from Toledo to TPS.
The area in red is the Glendale land owned by TPS, the area in yellow is what is referred to as the Schneider Park area, it is currently owned by the City.
The division is on several issues, TPS’s position is that both ordinances have to pass, basically the Ryder/Glendale land swap was asked for by the City administration in return for the Bowman swap, it was initially stated the city supported it as a package, but Ricci Gardner gave the impression that they would support one or the other. TPS could still go forward with a new school at Longfellow without the land swap, though it does not appear likely they will give Toledo the other two land parcels without the Bowman swap. Students currently at Longfellow would be bused to a different location, probably Nathan Hale during the construction since it’s been determined it would not be ideal to build the new school while the old school is still in use due to the size of the lot. TPS’s position is if the construction project is delayed past 2011, a revaluation of the student numbers from Columbus would result in less construction dollars since enrollment has decreased since this money was granted.
The neighbors that are against this do not want to lose the school location for a variety of reasons, one of those is that they have no faith that the City of Toledo would properly maintain the site as a park and property values. Another is the feared impact of the loss of a neighborhood school on their neighborhood, a little over 100 children are now bused, the rest of the almost 500 walk. The new campus location would create the opposite scenario with a little over 100 walking and the remaining being bused. Several of the neighbors felt they could split the district between two other local elementary schools during the construction phase instead of busing to Nathan Hale and that they were originally promised Longfellow was going to be rebuilt on the same site. Over 800 residents of the neighborhood signed a petition against the school being moved. The overall feeling of the residents opposed is that a two year transition for students was preferable to a long term elimination of Longfellow in their neighborhood.
The overall feeling of those in support of the Bowman location for Longfellow is safety from a transportation standpoint, since more students would be bused instead of walking given the traffic issues and the general belief that the new location would present more opportunities with the greenspace and the YMCA. It would also be an easier transition for students and staff since they would not be moving until the new Longfellow was complete.
The Meeting:
Webb, Ashford, Brown, McNamara, Shultz, Steel, Collins, Craig and Sarantou were all present for the Youth, Parks & Recreation Meeting that was held yesterday.
Juanita Greene, Executive Director of the Board of Community Relations spoke first, she covered the mediation efforts that took place and what is planned depending on the decision made by Toledo City Council. She also stated this process pointed out that there needs to be more of an effort by the governmental entities, (school and city) in providing information to neighborhoods.
John Foley and John Gilliland spoke next on behalf of Toledo Public Schools, Foley acknowledged the original plan was to rebuild on the Longfellow site, which would have necessitated a “swing option” (moving students to a temporary location while a new school is built) and they looked at the traffic issues related to the current site. There was a recommendation from the architects that it would be very difficult to build on the site with the current school in use. Eight or nine months ago they began discussing this with Toledo as far as land in the area. That’s when the land trade between Bowman and Longfellow came about, he said the members of the school board and the parents have been informed of the process. He said those on both sides of the issue were at the meeting in the Spring. The current plan is to build at the outer edge of the Longfellow district and was felt to be a viable spot because of the new high school and the new YMCA facility and would still include greenspace. They’ve also discussed maintenance partnerships, such as the School system when cutting the grass at the Start complex would cut Bowman Park. Foley said TPS would arrange for the Longfellow building to be demolished, but it would then be up to city as to what happened next with that land. Foley said if this does not go forward quickly, it does impact the funding since in 2011 they face the possibility of losing funding, they would go forward in sending the students to another school and building on the current site.
Webb stated if the land swap happens, Toledo City Council would then have to zone the former school site, the next step would be to discuss with the neighbors as to their expectations for the land use. Craig asked how many are bused now, approx 115 are now, approx 500 would have to be transported to the new Longfellow School.
Shultz asked the status of Smith, Robinson and that only Warren School has been removed. Foley said he is not sure about Smith (there is no Smith School) but that the Martin Luther King at Smith park is being used as a swing location for Pickett students. Warren was a hazard which is why there was an expedited demolition, Robinson is being discussed with the City of Toledo and after the new Pickett school is built Martin Luther King would be preferably demolished but they have to go through a process for that. Foley said they have kept the city up to date on the process. Foley said part of the demolition contract is to return the land abated.
Ashford asked about the landlock issue, Foley said yes, it is a tight space and they have found it works best when they can avoid using swing space. He asked where what phase they are in, Foley said they are in the last phase of school factilities funding, the funding was locked in for enrollment, that will change in 2011 and the funding would be based on the new student numbers which could create less funding. He also asked how many schools were remaining, Foley said 7, that they have to be done by the end of 2011, it takes 18 months to build an elementary, a high school or middle school can take close to two years. Ashford asked if this was the first campus like setting, Foley said it would be the first to encompass a high school, an elementary and a YMCA but that there was a campus setting at Rogers with McTigue. Ashford expressed support of the concept of the students being bused as opposed to walking in that location.
Collins asked if the City administration was going to share their insight as well as knowing what insight the future Bell administration’s insight is on this property, he said they are considering something without knowing what either administration’s vision was. Webb stated Reinbolt was invited, he was not able to attend, representatives from the City in lieu of him will be speaking next. She stated if this legislation passes the Bell administration would have to follow it but she will communicate with Bell. Collins asked what other properties were mentioned, there was one piece of land mentioned on Glendale, and where Ryder School is that the city would gain in addition to the land the current Longfellow school is on. Xunlight is interested in the Ryder location but TPS would have to offer it to a charter school, which is why the City was interested in that land piece, because Xunlight and the economic development factor. The City would also be giving TPS a small triangle of land piece next to Devilbiss (though I had to laugh because ordinance 642 calls this “Devilish High School” ).
Webb stated she felt this issue stands on it’s own and while TPS has presented it as more of a package deal, that is why it was presented as two separate ordinances. The other ordinance (642) has already been given first reading by Council. Sarantou wanted to know the land size, Foley said he believes the current Longfellow location is 4.9 acres and the Bowman site is 6.2 acres. Sarantou then went through what was asked before as the challenges of building the new school on the present location while the old school remained. Since that has already been covered, nothing new was said to transcribe.
Ricci Gardner from Economic Development and Jeanette Morell from the City’s Real Estate department were up next. Gardner first said he was not prepared to discuss this, he thought Bob Reinbolt was going to be the one to present the information. He said after the building was demolished the City would go through zoning to establish the land use. Morell said the pieces given to the city would be beneficial, the piece on Glendale would allow access to the soccer fields, and the City was not using the triangular piece next to Devilbiss.
Collins asked who was going to tear down the house, Morell said the City would tear down the house and put the road in. Collins asked where they would park the cars since the soccer field is. Morell said that whole site is going to change because of the water lines. Collins then wanted to know what would happen if this is not a package, since it’s been stated TPS wanted this as a package, what if Council does not pass Longfellow. Foley said our discussion on the Longfellow site was on the Longfellow site, the City of Toledo entered into additional discussions, once City Council passes this it goes to the Board, if it is broken out, Foley does not know if he would recommend it for approval. Webb asked for clarification meaning if one passes and one fails, Foley said correct. Collins said he felt it needed to be asked, Webb didn’t disagree stating this was an example of what they have been fighting since they have been on council, the administration not including them in situations like this as far as information or being included in the process when it impacts their districts.
Webb also said she believes Longfellow should stand on it’s own merits. Gardner stated if one piece fails the other piece fails, City will not go forward with it. Webb said then if Longfellow fails, if it’s decided it’s not in the best interest of the neighborhood then the other pieces don’t happen? Gardner said they would prefer for it to happen but he doesn’t believe TPS or the City would go forward if it is separated piece, despite Webb feeling as if they should be separate pieces. Gardner clarified they share Webb’s belief that they be broken apart but it was up to TPS. Shultz wanted to know who did the negotiations, Gardner said that was before his time but he believed it was Reinbolt and Kroma, she then went on to talk about the amount of money that has been spent by the City on Bowman Park, she wanted the total because they have an obligation to protect their investment since it was supposed to be a signature park. She went through the list of improvements that had been made to the park. She also said there is no appraisal on either property and she said there was no inclusion of the Park Board and that was why the land was zoned to keep it park land. She said this switch deprives the citizens the use of that field. She also thought it would be wise idea to talk to Commissioner Wozniak since she was involved with the legislation for Bowman when she was on Council.
The explanation on the ordinance was the TPS would not deed the property originally agreed to in 1995 back to the City, they would use it for the new Longfellow school. Morell said the portion they are swapping is a piece that TPS already owns, the original Start high school land, they were going to give that to the City as part of the original legislation in 1995, Bowman Park would still exist. The summary and description from that ordinance that was passed in 1995 by an 11-0 vote:
ORD. 19-05
Authorizing the Mayor to enter into a Development Agreement with the Toledo City School District Board of Education for the redevelopment of a portion of Bowman Park and Start High School; making certain findings with respect to Bowman Park; and declaring an emergency.
SUMMARY & BACKGROUND:
The City of Toledo has cooperated with the Toledo Public School District with respect to its building program in a manner that will benefit both the District and the City. The Council has previously approved a zone change and a Master Plan for the property that constitutes Start High School, Bowman Park and the YMCA (Ordinance 833-04). In accordance with the approved plan, this legislation authorizes a Development Agreement that will result in the conveyance of certain parts of Bowman Park to the District, in exchange for the conveyance of District property to the City. There is no net loss of park land as a result of this project, and, in fact, after the transfers the City will have somewhat more property than before. In order to maximize the use of funding being provided by the Ohio School Facilities Commission, the Development Agreement is structured to provide for leases between the City and the District and then ultimately the conveyance of the respective properties.
During the public commentary portion it was also revealed that DuPont, which owns the Dibble Park land, had testing done in 2006 that stated that land was safe for any use.
Most of those opposed to the landswap focused on their feeling that the city has ignored the Library Village area and that removing the school would harm their neighborhood and that they had no assurances that the land would become park or that it would be properly maintained. It was also revealed that a zoning ordinance that would have made Bowman Park an institutional campus area was on hold, it was placed on hold at the request of Webb since she felt that decision was premature. Those opposed also had concerns related to the traffic that would be increased on Laskey and the location of the traffic light that was already there as far as how could a new one be placed.
Those opposed felt that they were initially led to believe that the children would not be bused, learning that they would be bused was a relief to some, others felt that could change and did not trust that as a promise. The phrase “Longfellow School is the heart of the neighborhood” was referenced as a basic theme for those in opposition of the building being demolished. There was also discussion as to the of studies supporting that it would be beneficial to move the students to the campus location as opposed to keeping them at the current location, that they should have been done and if they were done they wanted to see them. The lack of communication was touched on by several. The problem with home foreclosures and the fact that many purchased their homes because of it’s proximity to the school was referenced several times.
Traffic count material was shared by one resident, to make the point that the traffic pattern at the current Longfellow was normal compared to other sites. Floodplain concerns and violation of height requirements were also mentioned as well as LOMAR letters (Letter of Map Revision (US Army Corps of Engineers) which were stated have expired on the current Start property, that could add to flooding and the lack of monitoring documents was not done for the prospective campus setting. 1106.0801 -1110.0712 -1110.0900 were the cited Toledo Municipal Code elements that were also felt would be in violation.
One resident felt having the new school in his backyard would impact his property value since he bought his property because of Bowman Park being there. Other residents expressed an impact on their property value by losing the school. One resident said homeless sleep in the park and that there are gangs in that park, that some teenagers are afraid of some of those who go to Start and go to Bowman Park. She said it’s not safe in Bowman Park, she also shared there was a dirt pile that she said was contaminated that was supposed to be removed that wasn’t and said they could have a similar scenario to Clyde where children are getting sick and that this was supposed to be a wetland where animals live. Another resident countered that and stated she has not seen crime reports for Bowman nor ever experienced a problem while in Bowman Park. One resident expressed the two ordinances both having to pass placed the neighborhood in almost a hostage situation. One teacher expressed that some of the current walkers have to go past “unsavory locations” such as bars, a tattoo shop. One speaker felt having his children around teenagers who are smoking, drinking and the language they use would be a factor to not have the campus location, he said if the school is relocated he would move. He also said that he heard from the architect that they could build the school design at either location, another speaker echoed the concerns of mixing high schoolers and elementary children.
Those who spoke in support of the campus location felt that the new location would be a safer and quieter location for students and they had faith in TPS that they would bus the students as promised. The environmental aspect of being on a green space area was also felt to be a benefit to students, physically and educationally. The ability to partner with the YMCA and being in a secure location with an bus loop was also mentioned as a benefit and that they would still be a strong neighborhood at the new location. It was stated that the current location was not safe for children, that one who walked was hit by a car recently, that this student would be bused if the new location was selected. That when the school was built 90 years ago there was not the same traffic. The principal and two teachers were among those who spoke. Those who support the campus location felt the new location would be safer, the issues related to losing students during the transition phase was referenced by one of the teachers.
Traffic noise was raised as an issue but realistically a new school would be quieter.
Craig asked when the building would be demolished, it was stated the students would be moved over Christmas break with an expedited building schedule if the Bowman park site is not selected. The Bowman location would also be able to investigate geo thermal, that there could be a longitudinal system instead of a deep well one.
Thanks for the summary. This could become a really contentious issue.
I would hope that all parties involved will be able to handle the issue in a positive and constructive manner.
December 2nd, 2009 at 7:44 pmI understand the neighbors who don’t want to lose the neighborhood school, I also understand the parents who don’t want to go through the two year transition. I understand why TPS may not agree to the second swap ordinance since they agreed to get the Bowman land. I understand why some on council may feel as if over 800 neighbors speaking out has to be taken into consideration and I also understand some of the economic development desire related to Xunlight. This is a scenario where compromise is going to be difficult and there are some unanswered questions.
Will they be answered before Council’s next meeting? That remains to be seen. One of the neighbors had a point, they knew about the earlier meeting but the communication wasn’t clear as to the purpose, so they didn’t attend. The communication between Council and the administration was another factor, the City has been negotiating this with TPS for close to 9 months, had members of Council known, it may not have changed the outcome, there would still be those for and against; but it would have given more time for the community to feel as if they were being heard and it would not have been the current rush scenario it is now.
December 2nd, 2009 at 8:09 pmI have watched the building program for years. TPS has never assured proper notice went to residents and they have never stated what their intent was on the notices so most people have just thought it another unimportant TPS meeting. Several of us made a number of recommendations early in the program when problem after problem occurred regarding proper notification. They merrily went about their business without making any changes.
In the recent case of Longfellow (and in almost all other cases), they distributed notices primarily to parents. Staff at Longfellow knew of course and participated.
TPS has always tried to avoid involving the whole community. Why? Well my opinion is that they want as little scrutiny as possible and it is easier to control staff and a small group of myopic parents focused only on their children – parents rarely see the long term implications of the decisions being made. Democracy can be a messy business and democracy is not the business TPS is in even though they are a public institution.
This is absolutely about Xunlight getting Ryder School and TPS avoiding the possibility of it being sold and becoming a charter school as charter schools get first option on the property under state law.
Without the Xunlight issue, this swap would not pass council in my opinion based upon the research I have done. However, jobs are an important issue and it appears council is willing to trade the future stability of a neighborhood (the Library Village area is under real pressure with extremely high foreclosure rates that I have been told are the highest in the city)for the possibility of jobs.
So council is set to vote on this issue and there has been no discussion about Xunlight and what kind of deal is happening. What job or investment guarantees will Toledo get for the investment? I have been told that the city wants to transfer to Xunlight the property at little or no cost. We all know the great deals that Finkbeiner has gotten this city into as Mayor.
It would appear that the Longfellow neighborhood is not important enough for council to assure that it is done in the full light of day and with all the facts on the table. This neighborhood appears to be the sacrificial lamb in this “deal”.
Why the rush to get the land swap deal done? What is the Xunlight deal all about? Has council really looked at all the facts or are they just buying the information provided by TPS? (And that information has been at the least misleading)
Watch out folks, your neighborhood could be next. When will transparency and accountability to be a priority with both the City and TPS? Yea, it probably will never happen unless we citizens wake up and say wait a minute. But apathy reigns and we suffer from our lack of diligence as citizens and residents. In my opinion, there is more to being a good citizen than just voting, but I am likely in the minority and this is certainly an idea that politicians hope never comes to fruition.
December 3rd, 2009 at 1:18 pmI would like to know the Xunlight deal is about. Seems like green energy jobs are dominating the board right now and to see it pop up here is weird, or is it?
December 3rd, 2009 at 1:40 pmXunlight is a solar start up out of UT. I interviewed last year for a job there, but being a start up, they couldn’t afford me.
Their product does look cool, I wish them the best of luck.
As for all this land swapping, I’m just happy that someone wants to use some/any land in Toledo.
December 3rd, 2009 at 2:00 pmIs it free land? I think anyone would be willing to do somethign with free land.
December 3rd, 2009 at 2:14 pmThe problem folks is that TPS is using this as a way to hold the Longfellow neighborhood hostage to get what they want despite the consequences to the neighborhood and without complete disclosure of all the facts as well as a review by council of the impact on the city of the TPS plan and council is being complicit in aiding them. Why?
I want economic development and good jobs as much as the next guy, but this deal smells and council seems to be jumping on the bandwagon without due diligence – which includes questioning the administration about the deal. Funny thing – at this committee hearing Reinbolt did not show up and sent two folks that frankly could not answer the questions posed to them. Interesting way to avoid answering the questions.
December 3rd, 2009 at 3:26 pmOne of the things that has always bothered me about the decision making at TPS as it relates to site decisions and the building program is the increased costs for the general fund. All the administrative costs of the program are coming from the general fund. In 2003 it was estimated to be at least an additional quarter of a million per year. However, that did not consider the time of employees to administer and monitor the program.
With the Longfellow decision, TPS is expecting to bus about 370 more students. In 2003, I did some research on the costs at academies and that included the cost of transporting students. At that time, the costs were running between $1,100 and $1,400 per student for yellow bus students. Obviously fuel and labor costs have increased since 2003. A lot of factors figure here but $1,000 per student seems a good conservative estimate of the cost per student. I believe it will be higher, but let’s use that figure for now. Nonetheless, 370 students means about $400K more per year in transportation costs than would be necessary if the building was not sited at the Jackman Road location.
So, once the building is completed in 2011, TPS over the following decade would spend $4 to $5 million more in transportation costs.
This decision will cost teachers or textbooks or computers – something has to give – or higher taxes. Since labor costs are about 80% of TPS expenses, the logical conclusion is that teachers would be laid off.
Higher future costs mean less money for what counts to improve education.
In all the decisions I have seen TPS make in this building program, I have never seen them consider the future costs of their decisions. They may but it is not something they have discussed publicly. They are quick, however, to point out that these buildings save energy costs. Well with Longfellow sited on Jackman Road, costs to the taxpayer would decrease due to building efficiencies, while eliminating the need for higher transportation costs.
December 4th, 2009 at 8:37 amJohn Wenzel
Berwick ave.
City council has ignored the fact that it has received 800 signatures from the Longfellow School community to keep the school at its current location. This included nearly 10% of its signatures from Longfellow parents not wanting the school to move and 70 of these signatures are from the proposed location’s neighbors. Council also received results from a PTO survey of 158 parents of these results of only 32 parents wanting the school to move, 16 parents were against the move and 12 undecided. These numbers clearly show what the neighborhood wants and that parents are showing a lack of concern.
The fact is city council has been working with TPS for a long time behind closed doors on this land swap and the only thing that matters is acquiring the land it needs for Xunlight at the Library village’s expense.
The Dec 1st debate in City Council chambers was only a facade on the part of the City Council members in an attempt to make it look like they were concerned about the public. In fact all along they were going to approve the land swap at our expense for the sake of possibly creating some new jobs for Xunlight.
John Foley will not be around when TPS attempts to pass a large millage levy for the increased operating costs that he is responsible for. He has signed a (non-binding) statement to bus the children to the new location. He will not be here when the new school opens and children are not being bussed because of the lack of money.
City Council has forgotten that it works for the people – not big business. We elected them to represent our views and in this case it has not been happening. All I have seen from them is deception.
December 5th, 2009 at 2:24 pmJohn, the City administration may have been working with TPS but City Council members were not, at least none of the ones I’ve spoken with through all of this, while Mr. Reinbolt has the answers to those questions and he did not attend the hearing, John Foley made it clear how long this had been going on, 8 to 9 months.
You are correct though as to Foley will not be there in the future so the agreement to bus children is not one that can be held as binding, the elimination of sports and busing are always the first two items threatened to be cut when there is a need for a levy. It’s the standard vote by creating fear policy exhibited by political parties and government on numerous issues because it works, it shouldn’t but it does.
December 5th, 2009 at 5:35 pmI live behind the current Longfellow Elementary and am opposed to its relocation. As a public, tax supported entity, TPS has the responsibility to listen to the people who support it financially. Lack of comminication and disdain for the public have been the hallmark of TPS dealings withour neighborhood.
December 8th, 2009 at 9:53 amTPS’ failure to plan should not be be borne by the taxpayers of Toledo. Unfortunately, with Foley now a lame duck, he will have even less incentive to be responsive.